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Hamilton Harbour.....


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well said Steve, you got to love those small creek systems that are just packed with small trout. And yes, grindstone does seem to be taking a fall. Ever since they did the last changes to it, i havent seen much life as i have before. In one day of fishing that creek my buddy and I caught, bass, trout, carp, sucker, redhorse, pike, bluegill, bullhead and even a small perch. In my opinion thats a good area with lots of Biodiversity among the fishes. Last couple of years, i havnt seen much fish at all...well just carp. So hpefully something happens for its own good.

Dan

Thanks Dan . I agree with you 100%. There's the point us carp fishers have made all along. They messed with the stream until only the carp can survive and then we blame the carp for being there.

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Guest Rockfish
these small creeks and streams you speak, do they hold a solid resident rainbow population, what about browns? Are their decent may fly hatches?

The Redhill and Grindstone creeks are quite small and can be very shallow with no rain with a few holes through the summer and u can jump across them in alot of spots. :lol: So not likely it would have a very big Trout population and alot of the Grindstone is sanctuary till the end of April below the Waterdown falls but for some reason people still try to fish there before it opens. ;)

I took a hike at the RBG trail under the Plains rd bridge in Burlington last Fall and alot of it is marshland there. They have a plaque up about stocking Pike there in a controlled Spring flooded marshland and from 1990-2004 the Pike have increased 20 fold. It was supposed to be in the hope to reestablish the natural species like Pike and they would eat the baby Carp (Sorry Carp fishers) :D and also reestablish vegetation in the area.

The breakwall with the rows of X-mas trees and whatever they put in a few yrs ago around the Valley Inn rd has seemed to have kept the Carp out of the marshes there so the plants can grow. Everyone does have their favourite fish to fish for though.

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No need to be sorry. In a healthy system the carp are part of the food web like everything else. But the RBG are liars. I have been in there to watch the pike spawn in the spring this past year. Ten years ago I was in there to watch the pike spawn and fourty years ago I was in there to watch the pike spawn. I can remember seeing pike there over 20 lbs. That why I like to visit.

As far as excluding carp goes they haven't. Several years ago just after they completed their remaking of the creek in Hidden Valley I had lunch in there. It was June I believe. I watched about ten carp ( 2-6 lbs) happily feeding in the creek.

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The carp are still getting up the creek as far as the 403. In the fall the carp are in the same holes as the big chinnies. I got some good pics a few years back while taking the dog for a walk. In the spring they hold the same water as the bows and they seem to be there in larger #'s every year. they blocked the carp from getting to the marshy areas but not to the actual creek. i like fishing grindstone cause u don't get as many loogans as bronte or the credit. there aren't any fish around here in flamborough, only in town at fortino's or sobeys. if u wanna know about the trout fishing around here then find a local and ask questions. i am kinda new to the area but my wife grew up here and her family knows alot ppl and alot of them seem to fish and have shown me a few secret spots that i will take to the grave. although joe might know a few things about fishing around here.

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yes, thats true, the carp still make it up as far as they want in grindstone. A few years ago we we down to hidden valley to check out some of the pools for chinnook. Well we did see alot of fish, unfortunatly THEY WERE ALL CARP! There must have been at least 30 of them in the one pool right infront of the parking lot. There were some swimming around but as well looked closer, they were all sitting on the bottom with their heads in the undercut part where the wood supports are. It was rediculos. It seems like they are the only fish having a solid ru in there. Dont get me wrong, ive seen ALOT of rainbows in the pools some days in the spring. But, my god we couldnt believe what we were seeing. I would have loved to drop and Aqua Vu down there to get an exact couunt on the number of these fish. But if this continues, grindstone will be a lost cause for a very long time. Mark my words!

Dan

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Guest Rockfish

Thanks for the carp update. ;) I used to see them in the Hidden Valley also in that little pool along with the bows that were trying to jump over that hump until the rearranging of the creek back in about 2002.

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Geez I wonder who is responsible for blocking the carp from the marshes and forcing them to look elsewhere.

This reminds of two fiction books I have read. One was Jurassic Park and the other,was one I read in highschool Lenningin vs the ants. Both were fiction but had a reality as the theme.

But to get back to the harbour. It seems that until they solve the ammonia problem the restoration of the bay will not be possible. I think that this year it could be worse than ever do to all the rain we have had. Has anybody heard how they plan to deal with it.

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Geez I wonder who is responsible for blocking the carp from the marshes and forcing them to look elsewhere.

simple answer - rbg. their primary interest is not the restoration of fish and wildlife - their only interest is flora and they are happy to eliminate the other elements, such as fish and animals, in order to protect their plants. heck, the carp gate stops carp but has also horribly effected the spawning runs of all the other fish species that used to flood into cootes, especially in the spring. they have in the past even subtlyexpressed the desire to eliminate human visitors to the rbg as well, and probably would in a heartbeat if they didn't need the $$ so badly. think peta for plants.

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Ola, you can bet they are trying very hard to have fishing banned from Cootes. It's in their mission statement to create a living museum out of the marsh. That means you can look but do not touch. It's a shame that they even have pulled the wool over the eyes of some local fishers, who are vocal supporters of this guy Tyce.

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Lol Machiavelli would last two minutes in the Hamilton Harbour Commission :Gonefishing:

Sure Sheila Copps was tough to listen to, but look around at Bayfront and realize having a deputy Prime Minister has it's benefits.

It's the same for all "environmental projects" in this country, which special interest has the most clout gets the most cash to push it's agenda. Heck look at the Atlantics, logging & parks.

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the creek is a santuray from sept 30th but opens again in time for trout season and if they really cared then make a santuary during trout season and let the chinnies be open for fishing, but they really don't care about the fish and wildlife just the plants and trees. but if u like carp and suckers then it's the best place to fish, and i have seen cormorants as far up as the foot bridge near the end of the rbg area before u get to hidden valley park.

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ya i thought that was stupid too. Why not let us fish the chinnook run? I think alot of people out there would rather a rainbow comeback than a chinnie comeback...well its all about the plants right? and them damn carp are just packed like sardines in there. You can go to a larger pool and find a solid 30 of them just stacked in there. I say why not it be the steelhead like that? Well the rbg has other ideas of what they want to do with that creek. The last year the only thing i saw in there other then carp during the summer was chub, or sucker. Didnt even see and young rainbows like i usually do or for that case catfish... I dont know what they plan on doing with grindstone, but so far they have just made it worst in my opinion. So much diversity down the drain...

Dan

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"them dam carp" would make a good chorus for a song. B)

Seriously carp have survived our manipulating the enviroment for hundreds of years. They don't need to be molly caudled with stream renovations, hatcheries and the like.

What did you expect? The only thing to survive the RBG's tender lovin care is the carp. They will always be there. I can guarrantee you that after operating the carp barrier for ten years you can catch more carp in Cootes than any other species. They are part of the ecosystem and they are survivors.

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oh, im not trying to say its the carps fault. Its pur fault to have let them get into the ecosystem to begin with. And like you said, they are indeed natural survivors. I'll stick with the common carp right now, i just think were a F****D if the asain carp get in...those are where the troubles at...

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I agree about the Asian carp. They are a big concern. The barrier that they have operating now is not the full scale barrier but a smaller "test barrier" It will stop large asian carp from getting through but there is concern that it does not work as well for small fish. Also the fry of the asian carp are very similar in apppearance to some types of baitfish. Anglers may unknowingly spread them. There is no doubt that their introduction into the great lakes would cause some very big changes to the ecosystem.

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your talking about that electric berrier right? and yes, if they do get into our lakes, even in a small number to start, immediate action must be taked to get rid of them! look what they have done to the mississippi, and other large river systems. If they got in and started to breed immediatly then their numbers would start to multiply beyond anything. Once they would be in, there probably wouldnt be a way to stop them. It eventually lead to the catastrophic failure of our aquatic ecosystem...i really hope that fence holds out and a new bigger one is implimented!

Dan

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