Dan Andrews Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 I hope these guys get their guns jerked. Careless discharge is a serious offence. Especially when its 24o feet away from a house where children are playing! http://www.niagarafallsreview.ca/ArticleDi....aspx?e=2435197 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smerchly Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 From what I see & heard on the video Dan , they were allowed to hunt on the 100 acres next door . Is there a defined no shoot zone where the dog owner's house can be seen ? Are there any posted signs on the dog owners property ? I would make sure hunters don't shoot where the kids are playing . I didn't know that coyotes could be almost black until Herb brought a black yote skin to our meeting . I think more hunter training is needed , they were either very careless & deserve to be prosecuted , or we need better ways to protect people from being accidently shot . I trust the investigation will reveal how this happened . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammercarp Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 I think I will wait for the full story. There are some un answered questions and some deliberate attempts by the media to play this up. It said the incident took place 2oo ft from a ditch where the kids caught frogs. ( In February???????) That is just plain incendiary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakerunner Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Chille: There is NO excuse for discharging a firearm before identifying you target. It would also be wise to have a bright collar for your dogs, to avoid this from happening. When venturing in the bush, one should wear bright clothing as well. In rural areas it might be wise to have your children wear hunter orange or bright toques or scarves. Lakerunner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightfisher Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Wow !!! No second chance. Lose their guns and never be allowed to hunt again. A civil suit should also be brought up against them. No excuse for this neglectful act. An example needs to be made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Andrews Posted February 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Well let me first apologize to the hunters for my knee jerk reaction. In this mornings paper 200 feet turned into 400 meters. It wasn't a slug it was a pellet and the dog had wandered onto the neighbours property to stock a mechanical decoy they were using for coyotes on a property they had permission to hunt and were doing so to help the land owner with a coyote problem. Seems coyotes there were walking right up to the house. So again I apologize; it is unlike me to take the medias word and get upset. In fact it is probably because I am more afraid careless hunting will end it for all of us and a return to the old days of hunting is not an option anymore. At least these guys tracked the animal back to its owner and rightfully confronted the media and police right away before too much anti hunting hoopla started. I also understand the dog owners exaggeration but claiming it was only 240 feet was a little over the top IF............. it was indeed 400 meters. Oh and shotgun shells would have never hit the house. Pellets maybe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave524 Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Well let me first apologize to the hunters for my knee jerk reaction. In this mornings paper 200 feet turned into 400 meters. It wasn't a slug it was a pellet and the dog had wandered onto the neighbours property to stock a mechanical decoy they were using for coyotes on a property they had permission to hunt and were doing so to help the land owner with a coyote problem. Seems coyotes there were walking right up to the house. So again I apologize; it is unlike me to take the medias word and get upset. In fact it is probably because I am more afraid careless hunting will end it for all of us and a return to the old days of hunting is not an option anymore. At least these guys tracked the animal back to its owner and rightfully confronted the media and police right away before too much anti hunting hoopla started. I also understand the dog owners exaggeration but claiming it was only 240 feet was a little over the top IF............. it was indeed 400 meters. Oh and shotgun shells would have never hit the house. Pellets maybe Hunters should have probably got a C.O. in on the debate. Dog running at large is probably a municipal offence, the dog hunts and probably runs deer as well , at one time a C.O. had the power to shoot a dog found running deer. Enough guilt to go around on both sides here, logic tells me that the best outcome is to drop it with everyone learning a lesson. If it came to court and my guns and hunting priviledges were on the line , I'd fight it. edit: the dog would have to be a coyote like species Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave524 Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 UPDATE: CHCH 11 had a video last night where they interviewed the hunter. Guy appears to be an experienced coyote hunter, dog owner and upright citizen. He has paid for the dog's vet bills. They included a photo of a dead black coyote, which uncannily looked a lot like the dog that was shot, would have been good if it was one the guy had previously taken, lots of variation in yotes especially when you get some dog in the mix, "coydogs". Showed the guys yote setup up , mechanized lure and they were probably using a predator call as well, dog came in stalking the lure and was shot at. I have done a fair amount of coyote hunting including some calling when I was younger, have my an " Ontario Hunter Safety Trainer Certificate" not a graduate but taught the program for a while and honestly I could possibly see myself being in this guys shoes in a similar setup. There was no mention of any charges being laid, as I feel it should be. Long term the biggest victim is going to be the hunter here emotionally I think, but in my opinion he bears the least guilt for what happened. Family pets, both dogs and cats, inflict untold carnage on our wild game and songbird populations. Anyone got any ideas on how to deal with free roaming cats in my residential neighbourhood that lie in wait and prey on the songbirds coming to my birdfeeder?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakerunner Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Report the Cats to animal control. Cats are not to be at large (if this is Niagra Falls) unless they are on the owners property. You could also take the cat to the humane society and the owner will have to pay to have it returned. Hunting dogs, also used to track coyotes are not exempt from these laws , and if wandering on property not owned by the Hunters or if the Hunters are not "Agents" they should be reported and treated likewise. As Chile mentioned before, the number one rule is know what you are shooting before you shoot. The dog owner was at fault, but the hunters should have been 100 percent sure of what they were "harvesting" With a shot gun, they must have been close to the coyote, if not close enough to make a lethal shot or identify the shot should not have been taken. Lessons to be learned here for sure. Black Coyotes are rare. Make sure it is a coyote before you fire. Owners of dogs should also have bright collars on the dogs to help in idenififcation Lakerunner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinocchio Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Sounds to me like the media ran with this one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smerchly Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Sounds to me like the media ran with this one! The media will exaggerate stories & put their own spin on them to stir the pot for their own agenda & I don't believe all that they print , I try to look outside the box . I agree with Dave524 . When I began to hunt small game at 16 , I was told to shoot cats in the woods because they kill game birds & can clean out the young partrige & pheasant chicks in no time . ......never saw a cat ! The dog's owner said his kids play 200 feet ? from where they shoot ?? There's a big diff. from 200 ft. to 200 yds.(600') . If my dog looked like a black coyote he would be trained to stay close to the house , on a leash , or in the house .The dog should not have been there . The hunter is half the blame here & paying half the vet bill would be appropiate , but he offered to pay the "shot".Good on him ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammercarp Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Toed Ja. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Andrews Posted February 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Well the story morphs into something bigger now. i called the paper as soon as I saw the other side of the story and asked the reporter to remove or update the online version to reflect changes before all the hoopla started. The hunter is now getting harassing phone calls and threats. He was there but wasn't the one who shot it and because it was him that put his name out there, our cities animal lovers are threatening him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakerunner Posted February 7, 2010 Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 I agree with Smerch: If my dog looked like a Coyote I would not let him fun free in a fire zone. At the distance mentioned it would be very difficult to distinguish between the two. As I suggested before perhaps an orange collar would be of some help. At least then the hunter would likely be able to tell if the cannine is domestic or a coyote before he/she harvests it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pike007 Posted February 7, 2010 Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 Oh boyyy, the media loves to make hunters look bad dont they, this def doesnot help us as hunters with rights and what not. Im going to have to say this a neutral situation, I think both the dog owner and the hunter are equally to blame. If the dog was fenced in this wouldnot of happened or at least wearing a noticable dog collar. Especially when a dog like a German shep can me mistaken very easily with these mixed bread coyotes we have around here. Ive see all black coyotes in NFS and NOTL. 007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammercarp Posted February 7, 2010 Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 If you wish to voice your opinion to the newspaper here is the link.http://www.niagarafallsreview.ca/feedback1/LetterToEditor.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pike007 Posted February 7, 2010 Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 If you wish to voice your opinion to the newspaper here is the link.http://www.niagarafallsreview.ca/feedback1/LetterToEditor.aspx Im really not one to take things that far , but someone should , why not? 007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smerchly Posted February 8, 2010 Report Share Posted February 8, 2010 The yote problem is getting more print lately . This one is only a few hours old & I am very familiar with all of the places mentioned .....I used to run my dog behind Ravine Rd. when I lived there .My dog ,an american staffordshire bull terrier , picked up parvo there & nearly died . It looks like the coyotes have taken over.......according to this source and no black yotes were mentioned in their description . http://www.stcatharinesstandard.ca/Article....aspx?e=2439067 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Andrews Posted February 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 I appreciate the post below the article for once smerch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakerunner Posted February 9, 2010 Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 Chile..yes some good advice below that article..Is this the same article that was in today's paper?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smerchly Posted February 9, 2010 Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 Chile..yes some good advice below that article..Is this the same article that was in today's paper?? Yes , same article lakerunner , I found it on line before the paper came out . They have "news updates " on line the night before it comes out in print . and , yes it's good advice to watch what food you have available to entice them to your back yard . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave524 Posted February 9, 2010 Report Share Posted February 9, 2010 Unfortunately, we have domestic dog in the gene pool here and that causes very wide variation in colour and probably accounts for a lot of the lack of normal human fear as well. When I hunted coyotes every winter weekend back in the late 70's/early 80's, if you saw a coyote 400 yds out in a field while driving, it would bolt if the vehicle stopped, now they walk boldly in residential areas. Here is a slide show of genetic variations in coydog mixes, some are obviously domestic doglike but other very closely resemble the coyote, which ones would you drop the hammer on ? Remember these are all some one's pet, but we have some out running around wild that look identical to these. There are no easy answers on this one, any ideas anyone? http://www.coydog.us/sundanceranch.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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